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Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
Noir. Mercenary Group
285
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Posted - 2013.04.30 02:07:00 -
[1] - Quote
I would like to see free passive SP removed from the game.
I have multiple alts. They have all been generating passive SP. I have used boosters to increase SP generation on my main, but there is no reason for me to boost how much SP my alts are making because they now have plenty, and they will continue to accumulate more and more of it.
Recently for this 3x SP week, the SP cap has been increased too. I bought and used one a discounted 7-day active booster for my alt. I realized that had my alt not had any passive SP generation, it is highly likely that I would have used boosters to get my alts started, or used them when I played.
If CCP made it so that passive SP is not generated on new characters unless they had a passive SP augmentation, I would have paid CCP more money. I cannot speak for anyone else, but I would happily have given more money to CCP. I do budget how much I spend on games a month, and I have bought many games over the past few months instead of boosters and the like for my alts.
I do not believe that this will make CCP lose money, because players who buy the merc pack for the active booster and AUR to buy passive boosters will continue to do so.
Over time, alts will also cause me to spend less money on this game. If my main has enough SP to do what I want to do for one primary role, I will play alts when I want to do other things. A few of my alts have prototype gear. Because my alts have top level gear, a large part due to passive SP, I feel less inclined to buy boosters for my main because I can already do everything I want to do.
To balance this, the paid for passive SP generation would need to be lower than the current passive SP generation. I believe that the difference between the current generation of free passive SP and the boosted passive SP should become the new passive SP gain. Perhaps increasing the active SP cap would be a good idea, but that is all up to CCP.
I also dislike the idea of passive SP. It seems counter to the entire game. When I first started and saw the words "Skill Points" and found out that you gained it even while not playing, I laughed because I thought the devs were making a big joke. If they are, it is still pretty funny, but people are taking it seriously, like it is something which should continue to be in the game.
And to reiterate, I am not for lowering the passive SP game, I am for removing it completely. Lowering it means I and others will just continue to do what we are doing with our alts anyways. |
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Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
Noir. Mercenary Group
285
|
Posted - 2013.04.30 02:11:00 -
[2] - Quote
tl;dr
Remove Free Passive SP gain, but allow players to continue to buy boosters that will allow them to gain passive SP at the current difference between the boosted and not boosted level. Example: you gain 50 SP a week, and someone with a booster gains 75. Now you'll gain 0 SP a week, and someone with a booster will earn 25.
Possible increase of the weekly SP cap by 50 SP to offset the loss in SP generation.
Or CCP could just remove passive SP entirely. I would be fine with that too, but I figure that they'll want people to continue to buy passive SP boosters. |
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Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
Noir. Mercenary Group
285
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Posted - 2013.04.30 02:54:00 -
[3] - Quote
I checked forums, and passive SP gain appears to be 168,000 without boosters. If there are four weeks in a month, and the game has been in open beta for three months, that means that the open beta has been around for about twelve weeks.
12*16800 = 2,016,000. So each one that I have not played has gained 2,016,000-ish SP. I think we start off with 500,000, so that puts me at around 2.5mil.
I only play three accounts regularly, but I have many more just generating passive SP, and they'll continue to do so for as long as passive SP is around ;) I thought about playing them, but then decided it would be more cool to start off on a brand new character with 0 games played, 0 kills, 0 losses, 0 wins, 0 deaths, etc etc with many millions of SP. Every once in awhile I log in to put points in the "core skills". |
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Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
Noir. Mercenary Group
285
|
Posted - 2013.04.30 03:42:00 -
[4] - Quote
Skihids wrote:Unless it's changed recently you can only activate passive SP for one character per account.
You need boosters to get passive on your alts.
PSN accounts are free. You can make more than one PSN account, and get the full free passive SP on that character there. It's not EVE where you have to pay a subscription for one account ;)
edit: So no, you do not need boosters to get passive SP on alts. |
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Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
Noir. Mercenary Group
285
|
Posted - 2013.04.30 05:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
Deadeye Dic wrote:Your argument and reasoning makes no sense and you have failed to otherwise provide a solid reason why it should be done away with, other than because you think so.
My argument is that I would have given CCP more $ had there been no free passive SP.
Some players have suggested that keeping passive SP in makes it so that there's less of a gap between people who no life it, and those who log on once or twice a month. That's terrible. Why should this game cater to players who do not even play?
This is not EVE. There is no subscription. If people are paying not to play, ie buying passive boosters, my request will allow them to continue to do so.
People cry every day about people AFK farming. Passive SP is AFK farming. |
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Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
Noir. Mercenary Group
285
|
Posted - 2013.04.30 05:39:00 -
[6] - Quote
People constantly write that "New Eden iz brutalz lolololol"
There is nothing "brutal" about one account just magically getting millions of SP. Yah right, this game is so "brutal" that you do not even need to play it to get good gear! |
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Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
Noir. Mercenary Group
286
|
Posted - 2013.04.30 14:57:00 -
[7] - Quote
Takahiro Kashuken wrote:Take away active SP and make it all passive skilling just like EVE
Don't be stupid. You should play the game if you want to get better, and not be hand-held all the way.
Yes, passive SP only makes the game lolmoarE-Brutalz for new players, but ******* easy mode for vets. Why don't the vets want to have active SP only?
Because they're weak and actually do not like or play "brutal" games. I've seen EVE guys whine that they got spawn camped so they are going back to EVE. So EVE is less brutal than spawning in a couple of times in a free suit and dying because you were too stupid to use drop uplinks? EVE even lets people get money from not fighting each other. You can generate money in EVE. It's not like every time you make money, someone else loses it.
That is completely counter to what DUST is like. If I want to make ISK, I go into a game and take it from other people. If I want to make lots of corp battle ISK, I am taking it away from another corp.
That's it. The only way that goes against the play to win idea are AFK ISK and SP farming, and passive SP is just another way of AFK SP farming. It's seriously hurting the game.
Passive SP also gives people the misconception that they will get better by not playing the game. That is stupid. Passive SP is CCP encouraging people to play other games instead.
I'm curious. I want numbers. I want to see how much activity increased when CCP put in the 3x active SP with cap increase. How many boosters were bought. Which alts had not been played were played. Who started new accounts for it.
I bet that CCP saw an increase in activity. This will only continue if CCP gets rid of free passive SP. |
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Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
Noir. Mercenary Group
287
|
Posted - 2013.04.30 18:05:00 -
[8] - Quote
Adstellarum wrote:and by this time the game ends and see that he receives 0 skill points and 0 isk because you decided to remove passive SP and Isk gains thus not allowing his character to grow at all even If it was just for 100 sp....... passive SP needs to be in because of the aforementioned case above
I think you're mixing up passive SP and the kind you get from being in a match. Passive SP is the SP that just happens on your character. If you look at the "skills" tab, at the top you will see your SP. You should also see your SP go up by 1 every few seconds. That is what I would like to do away with.
And I wasn't talking about starting SP. If you think that players should start with higher SP totals or just simply get more SP to help grow, that's a completely different discussion. I believe that there are other threads on this ;) |
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Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
Noir. Mercenary Group
287
|
Posted - 2013.04.30 21:52:00 -
[9] - Quote
Here's an example, which is someone like me:
> I have a main, but now I start an alt account for fun
> I get passive SP, so I do not play it.
> I log on months later, get lots of proto gear, and go proto pub stomping
Or:
> I have a main, but now I want an alt for fun
> I do not get passive SP, so I have to play it to skill up
> I play my alt, but most likely I'll buy a booster to give him a head start because I like the game enough to want to invest extra time in it via more accounts
Well, guess what I did? I made an alt, Chick Chicky Boom, got him up on the K/DR leader board in under a week of playing, then stopped playing him. I just let him gain passive SP. Now Chick Chicky Boom is in full proto gear, and is even harder to kill. I have over 800 HP, and I expect to get him to 900 HP on my logi suit.
This should not happen. I do not understand why anyone would want me to just have a bunch of alts in full proto gear, waiting to proto stomp them whenever I feel like it. I do not even need to play them to get SP, and I do not play most of my alts. They are just sitting there, gaining passive SP, and waiting for when I want to make them into something.
I believe someone from CCP said that CCP makes money when players lose gear bought with ISK or AUR. No players dying means no ISK or AUR. Since I wanted a full proto sniper, all I had to do was wait. I lost no items and I killed no people. No one else is losing items for me to gain SP too. It's just a big system where no one attacks other people and everyone gets as much SP as they want.
This game should not be about waiting for whatever you want so you do not have to fight to get it. I believe this game should be players fighting each other, and possibly PVE content to get what they need. Passive SP is an incentive that makes people not want to play the game.
Mary Sedillo wrote:All I see is someone who is running protos (the Bunny) getting angry because some of his precious suits are getting blown by people managing their SP well even though they aren't running protos.
Can't make everyone happy, but I think keeping both will keep a larger audience engaged, from the 'hardcore' (lol) players to those who have jobs.
^.^
Most of PFBHz does not run proto in pub matches. For example, take a new recruit. Watching the new guy proto pub stomp a bunch of MLT players while he already has a passive skill advantage means absolutely nothing.
I believe players should earn the same amount of SP as they do now, but only if they play the game. I see no reason why CCP should give a large number of people an incentive not to play.
I believe that passive SP makes the game worse, and that the game will be much better off without it. About 90% of the players who wear proto in pub matches that I have played against are terrible at this game.* I am not sure where CCP expects to get most of its revenue from, but I find it almost impossible to believe that CCP expects to get lots of revenue from players who do not even play the game. Players who have spent money on their main, as I have, will feel no need to spend money on alts because their alts have tons of free passive SP, and will only continue to earn more.
Keep in mind that unlike EVE, PSN accounts are free. Anyone can make as many accounts as he or she chooses to, and earn free passive SP on all of them.
And what about starting players as some have mentioned? I believe that a number of new players will see that they can be much better if they come back in a month or two after not playing for all of the passive SP. So a new player who believes this might quit the game, and not come back to play it. Ever.
If the player does decide to come back, that's the same as just giving him millions of SP to start with, which is something that many people here are opposed to. I have not seen many people write, "yah, give starting players two mil SP!" That is another thing that passive SP does.
I think CCP will make more money and get more people to keep playing if they do not give new players the option to delete the game and download it again a month or two later so they can start out with two million SP.
I am fine with CCP providing other options for new players to earn the amount of SP they want to start with, but passive SP is not the way to do it. |
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Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
Noir. Mercenary Group
288
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Posted - 2013.04.30 22:12:00 -
[10] - Quote
I forgot to put the * in lol.
Anyways, I put that there because it is mostly about AR users, and a large number of those who use proto lasers and shotguns. I'm going to go ahead and say that 80% of the guys using proto forge guns are good at using them. |
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